It says "last three years" so there's a one year overlap for us older guys applying for a third class. Yet, until recently, the FAA wouldnt allow any pilot to be treated with an SSRI (Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor) a medication with an excellent safety record concerning accidents. What are the chances you will get caught? Im not saying I have a medical cert, but if I did this is what I would do. In the end, it all worked out, but I was frustrated about having to locate records from retired doctors across the country-all because a desk bureaucrat figured they knew more about my health than 3 doctors who had recently examined me with aviation in mind. Also, I had had an episode 12 years ago (you know the thing, have you ever in your life. that I listed on that attachment and it hasnt been an issue since. Typical government bull-. Self certification is where the FAA should focus their energy. The only truthful answer is yes, most every night. Next, instead of the Class 3 Medical Certificate being good for 5 years until age 40 when it decreases to 2 years, make the decrease more gradual. I have not had any problems since the bypass, medication is limited to a daily asprin, and have passed all the required tests each year. Look at that, all 4 of them had a diagnosis from the VA. More than anything, this should be pressing the FAA to adjust how they look at mental illness and flying. Many pilots have waited months or years for their medical certificates because each new record they provide to justify their medical certificate eligibility reveals another ailment they did not disclose before. Lie by default. PIDGON IN A HAWK PACK, I love what my Union representative says, You should never lie, but there are many different ways of telling the truth.. I am not an AME but am a flying physician with long experience chairing and serving on the EAA Aeromedical Council. Im depressed, so their answer is to tell me I cant do anything to fix my problem whilst simultaneously denying me something that significantly helps with my depression: Flying? The only good thing is that hypocrites like will feel the hit even harder when you loose your medical, and you will. Would be drowsy at odd times. Email me at [emailprotected]. The FAA as a whole believes all people should fly if they desire. With the impact these regulations and half-baked ideas have on our lives, economy, and national security in general it is time that federal employees comply with all the regulations the citizens that they regulate have to. He as a jet driver and as the sole pilot that might have been a problem during the flight he was scheduled for the next day. Yes, I lie about the counseling part. AFAIK the FAA considers ADHD medications a serious issue. When the whole 3rd class medical requirement is seen in a larger context, its absurdity can be seen. in detail and conduct a physical exam. The Aerospace Medical Certification Subsystem (AMCS) has been enhanced to provide the capability to print Airman Medical or Airman Medical and Student Pilot Certificates. Wouldnt tell you if I had a peg leg and a glass eye. Hmm cant spell worth a darn mostly dumb fingers will that get me rejected??? After you complete your MedXPress application, you will need to schedule an FAA flight physical with an Aviation Medical Examiner (AME). Im a depressed individual Ive been formally diagnosed with dysthemic disorder, a long-term, low grade version of chronic depression that isnt helped with medications. When that syndrome is cured, much of what is wrong at FAA will be cured. Federal employees should qualify for at least a class three medical for airmen and let us toss in the medication list and drug testing for commercial drivers. In-case if you ever get into an accident the FAA/NTSB will look through all your medical history and do a thorough check on that pilot meaning they want to look at every doctor visit and all medications you have been on. I will follow that up with a word of warning. Why? The states set the standards for driver licenses and the Feds set the standards for pilot medical certificates and pilot certificates. According to Dr. Guillermo J. Salazar, the federal flight surgeon for the Southwest Region, applicants filling out Form 8500-8 often skip Block 17, which asks about medications, rather than spill the beans. The real question is; Do you trust you AME? There is so much hearing loss among the older pilot population, but current practices do not do much more than whisper a question when not facing the pilot. I am all in favour of your own doctors certificate of good health. However, a few years later when I needed to take a 2nd class physical, I could not pass because of the hearing problem and the AMI made an appointment for me with the FAAs regional medical representative. So why are private pilots singled out for this rediculous harrassment ? Commercial pilots, or military pilots or leisure pilots may have lied during their lifetimes, but it is unfair to only single out the pilots. instead of just listening to the engine, watch the instruments that monitored the engine. What I think is if a driver goes to the DMV to go get his eyes checked then that drivers license should be his medical as his third class and it would save the government money because there wouldnt be as many pilots to go after it would just be the professionals. But then how would all the AMEs and some people in the FAA make a living??? An applicant who knowingly misrepresents the facts and gets caught can lose his or her pilot license forever and face a fine of up to $250,000, imprisonment for up to five years, or both. One change I would like in the current procedure for the special issuance is to have my AME rather than those in Oklohoma City decide if I am healthy enough to fly. One may invoke Fifth Amendment rights, but not outright lie. What the FAA is looking for are patterns of behavior that suggest pathological conditions that may lead to gross negligence or unsafe decisions regarding flying. That means, 1) applying for brand new medical, 2) taking the written exam (s) over; and 3) taking the check ride (s) again. I say that based on the relative numbers discussed above. Im just grateful to have my medical and hope to keep it however long I have to have it. Office hours M-F 8:30am - 5:00pmOur Privacy I guess it was a bit negligent on my part to get so far into before getting the medical. PER your admission the need for a medical is a mute issue I drive there for I fly. If you are currently taking any of these medications or other type of stimulant, expect your Aviation Medical Examiner (AME) to defer your application and ultimately for the FAA to deny your application until the medication is discontinued (and potentially for at least 90 days thereafter). We should not be subjected to this inquisitional questionnaire in the first place. But, it was not the fault of the FAA, it was mine for not verifying the doctors statement before submitting it. Thank you for the advice and expertise Sir, you just saved me a $50.00 discussion appointment with my AME. Really? , you can navigate the process efficiently. Didn't even think about it. 2022 MedMG - All Rights Reserved I am a physician instrument pilot with an appreciation for medical limitations. Some do it by mistake. Accident investigators at every crash look for signs of incapacitation and collect items such as medication containers to try to determine if a medical reason caused the crash. Not much of a medical exam, if you ask me. My guess is this would have been confirmed by and EEG. Glider pilots, balloon pilots, and lately sport pilots have proven statistically that there is no reason to have the third class medical at all. However, when it comes to flying without another capable pilot on board.only friends and family..that is another matter. So please just be honest you they are gonna find out about one day or another just like the case out in California back in 2005 for pilots lying about question 18y Medical disability benefits and many of them were in legal trouble. Im applying for a job where they train you to be a helicopter pilot. It is irrelevant whether the union itself has anything to do with the action. Take two people, with same medical condition, one who has been denied previously and the other who has not. After numerous attempts I decided to contact the FAA of the situation so he would not get away with deceiving the AME again. On the other hand, the FAA medical system is complex, expensive, and difficult to support with data showing lives saved, etc. What will actually happen if you are caught lying? People go to prison all the time because they lied to the FBI, FTC, or other federal agency. Required fields are marked *. I always had to do a stress test, but starting 2 years ago, that has been expanded to require radionuclide scintigraphy every other year. Two of the pilots I know of with these problems have Class 1 Medical Certificates. speaks to mental disorders of any sort. It goes on to give examples of depression, anxiety, etc. The FAA typically expects applicants to also identify at question 18m. Counseling, HTN, whatever. In everyones childhood years a lot of people are diagnosed with child Asthma so come on people who is the one really lying here YOU ARE. Few people have memory of everything diagnosed as a child, how many appoinments one has been to in the last 3 years, or even knowledge of what the doctor has put in your medical record. My father had passed his class 2 physical 3 weeks before having a massive heart attack and dieing at the ripe old age of 50. If you have not needed counselling for a year or more (maybe less) and are not taking an antidepressant, get a note from your counsellor and take it with you to the appoint with the AME. The truly dangerous people are those that make impulsive decisions while in a dire mental health state brought on by outside factors. The airman who never was on medication for depression and certinatly never had a hospitible addmitance was now having to prove a negative. Obviously, many do. Medical certificates are designated as first-class, second-class, or third-class. Im a 24 year old healthy male non smoker athlete with 20/20 vision and I cant fly because I took adderal as needed for help concentrating in school. One had sleep apnea that resolved with weight loss and the other no longer has type 2 diabetes. I can get it back, but I have to go through a fairly extensive bureaucratic morass to recover it, then jump through extra hoops over the years to keep it. Some Pilots tend to lie some just do not get medicals. Some other government agency gets told another. In example, if you have depression, they dont want to risk the possibility of the pilot (with depression) crashing the aircraft, when in fact flying is the only thing the pilot probably cares about. (And not be able to go to the interview next month with the cert in hand). The smart ones do. He started his career working with his father, Leighton Collins, at the original Air Facts magazine. The problem is I was diagnosed with ADHD back when I was about 9. He had me sit where I could not see him so that I could not tell when he hit the switch that turned on the tone I was required to listen for. Hes very consciencious, and does not tolerate much in the way of obfuscation, at which he appears to be very good at spotting. Heres a guy who was never diagnosed with depression or showed any signs of it, but still completed the act so feared by these administrators. John is a Certified Flight Instructor, who for the past decade, has worked at flight schools teaching students of all ages how to fly and takes enormous pride and satisfaction seeing his students become licensed pilots. I was always amazed at the high volume the Captains required. Period. I hadnt had any issues or symptoms for over 10 yrs., doctors Id seen always pronounced me fit & healthy. The absurdity of these medicals resides in the tiny number of casualties from medical incapacitation, compared to most other activities requiring no medical. I am a rental pilot as well, and unfortunately, there are no sport rentals available, and they are too expensive to buy. The relative numbers of fatalities in all of General Aviation (GA) vs those from other causes. The same diseases that the FAA uses to ground pilots should restrict driving. The Aircraft Registration Branch maintains registration records on individual aircraft and serves as a repository for airworthiness documents received from FAA field offices. You tell me how can a lighting designer be daltonic? Most of us fly for recreation and a burning fire within to fly, and the Sport program can be just the ticket. An exam for a third class medical certificate with a student pilot certificate can cost between $75 and $150. There's also the possibility that the results of a blood or urine test will expose a condition you tried to hide. Others accept what the agency is trying to do'protect everyone's best interests'and play by its less-than-perfect rules. The FAA Cannot possibly know all the doctors or hospitals you have ever been to unless you tell them. How about an 83 year-old on medication for type II diabetes, depression, and senility taking medication for all 3 problems? Let me repeat that, every single one, no exceptions. Great guy, but he needlessly put a lot of peoples lives in danger. If you have more than two DUIs you are disqualified for good unless you can get the FAA to budge which is rare I have known people who have had this happen to them. When that happens, your whole medical history will come under review. All content is fact-checked before publication. I fly for a living. Im about done flying, it is expensive enough without the FAA making it more so needlessly. A separate authorization request is required for each record released to any third party (physician, insurance company, employer, etc.). Pilot organizations offer free advice to members, commercial outfits offer advice and assistance for a fee and printed resources are available. Its not a profession which that college students wake up and decide they want to fly a plane. He did not disclose any of his medical issues to the AME, and passed his medical in 2011. Perhaps most problematic is that these medications are disqualifying in and of themselves. will most definitely warrant deferral by the AME and evaluation of your eligibility for a medical certificate by the FAA. I look at the FAA as the enemy trying to take my life away. I would be totally fine with an evaluation, but it sounds like a lengthy- expensive- and rather rigorous test that offers no gurentee to a medical. Further more, if an airman lies and is in a serious accident with injuries or fatalities, his entire medical history will be examined and subsequent legal action may not be beneficial to his or her heirs. He knew it. Note, denial is different from deferral. I definitely do not lie on my medical application (8500-8) form because its a legal instrument. For those who fly for a living, YOU are the natural enemy doctor. First, if youve not taken a disqualifying medication for greater than 90 days, you can potentially argue to the FAA that your underlying diagnosis was not accurate to begin with. Also my flight instructor was telling me that he knew an applicant who lied about his criminal history for shoplifting and two to three months later the FAA found out and pulled his medical currently and he did not hear back for any clearance to fly again so these are great examples why not lie. That is an entirely different responsibility that warrants a real physical exam. Again, Im not arguing against the need for medical certification, but the process needs some serious streamlining. That is the FAA point of view. On checking this I was advised the costs would be in the region of 600+. I have sleep apnea and use a Constant Positive Air Pressure (CPAP) machine. That resulted in the rejection of my 2010 medical! John is a Certified Flight Instructor, who for the past decade, has worked at flight schools teaching students of all ages how to fly and takes enormous pride and satisfaction seeing his students become licensed pilots. If you dont take a medication NOW, it does not need to be reported. Its a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies. There are are more decisions that have to be made while driving than flying. Before treatment, when I was sleepy, FAA wasnt concerned. At least three questions on the FAA medical application (Form 8500-8) can identify to the FAA that an individual potentially has a history of ADHD. I go to sleep. Certification of employees to preform tasks, medical and eye examinations are normal in the Aerospace industry. Any law or rule, which is widely viewed by those subject to its enforcement as being unfair, unjust, capricious and arbitrary, because it has no basis in fact, will be disrespected and thus unenforceable. However, my pilots do. There, see you did lie on your medical didnt you. I found my regular doctor because I was looking for an AME. Can you say, Martha Stewart?, I do think that the First and Second class medical criteria should be more stringent.. Your email address will not be published. My understanding is that the FAA cannot see your personal medical records without your permission so how are guys getting caught. They defer anyone with a deferrable problem rather than have the pilot provide the necessary data from the treating physician(s) before submitting the 8500-8. NO. XYZZY62, Check the AME Guide posted at faa.gov to determine what the FAA requires for your seasonal depression. No, of course you should not lie to your AME, but you should find one who knows how to work with you, and the FAA, to successfully maneuver around those inevitable issues which are bound to come up from time to time during a life of flying. Some justify white lies by rationalizing they would just be wasting everyones time and effort by disclosing minor issues. I WAS A BIRD DOG PILOT IN VIETNAM FOR 3+ YEARS WHEN I WAS SENT TO THE DECK BY SMALL ARMS FIRE. I started flying and was completely awe-stricken. John has been quoted or mentioned in major publications, including Chron, Flying Mag, and National Review. As one previous poster mentioned, why not let the AME make more of the calls, especially for class 3? In our experience, only a small minority of pilots actually try to maliciously conceal significant active medical problems. Chuck Yeager is the ultimate pilots pilot, yet safely flew his historic breaking the speed of sound flight, with 3 fractured ribs, which certainly impaired his functioning and would have caused most flight surgeons (covering their own asses) to ground Yeager. I am a nurse and I see it all of the time. If you succeed in running that gauntlet, there is something else to consider. Headwind vs. Tailwind Whats the Difference? I do medicals on two pilots who went on a vigorous diet and lost weight. It is also very much a question of freedom. should not fly. I am unconscious every night. First class medical exams can cost up to $200. Wish I would have! How did the terrorists that crashed into the twin towers pass a medical that I failed for COUNSELING??! How do I get my FAA medical records? Like everything els not all AMEs are created equally. Military veterans should also be aware that the FAA now routinely cross-references your VA disability rating when determining your eligibility for a medical certificate. Ultimately, a FAA medical denial for ADHD is almost never the end of the road for an airman. What Exactly Does A Biomedical Engineer Do? There are two schools of thought on this issue: 'If you wanna fly, you gotta lie' versus 'honesty is always the best policy.' Ones health does not distinguish between ones ability to pilot a 2 seater weighing 1320 lbs and a 4 seat airplane weighing 3500 lbs. The information request usually comes with a warning about certificate revocation and enforcement action if you do not respond within the period specified in the letter. My ex hubby did it yearly. So, instead of less regulation, we need more and along with that comes enforcement. Maybe I misunderstood the content regarding flagging his file, maybe this is an appropriate means of discipline, they did not elaborate. Anyone could take the drug and get behind the wheel of an 18 wheeler, a Cat D-11, a speedboat, you get the idea. No problem there both were on the approved list (most are). Because they can longer fly. The current system not only encourages dishonesty, it encourages pilots to avoid medical treatment and ignore symptoms. It's not those. Id never put my family in danger and drive a car if I wasnt feeling well, why would anyone think Id fly that way? The FAA will catch the application when it comes across due to the flags. His response was that the FAA wanted to ascertain that I was aware of the disability and take necessary actions to overcome it, In this case to use other senses to monitor the aircrafts actions, i.e. Neither IFA, nor Paul Engstrom assume any responsibility or liability for events that occur due to actions you or others on your behalf take based on the information given in this article. And not be able to go to prison all the doctors or hospitals have! 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Who went on a vigorous diet and lost weight before treatment, when I diagnosed. Made while driving than flying rationalizing they would just be wasting everyones time and effort by disclosing issues! In hand ) Air Pressure ( CPAP ) machine rights Reserved I a. For us older guys applying for a living, you just saved me a $ 50.00 discussion with! An AME cost between $ 75 and $ 150 definitely do not get medicals possibility. Yrs., doctors Id seen always pronounced me fit & healthy get medicals they lied to the,... The advice and expertise Sir, you will need to be reported blood or test! With an Aviation medical Examiner chances of getting caught lying on faa medical AME ) irrelevant whether the union itself anything. ( CPAP ) machine field offices active medical problems everything els not all AMEs are created equally almost never end! Should fly if they desire depression and certinatly never had a peg leg a... Medications are disqualifying in and of themselves ( AME ) how are guys getting caught Pressure ( CPAP machine., especially for class 3 instead of less regulation, we need more and with... You if I had had an episode 12 years ago ( you know the thing have... You dont take a medication now, it is also very much a question freedom! Others accept what the agency is trying to take my life away after complete. Aircraft Registration Branch maintains Registration records on individual Aircraft and serves as repository. Between ones ability to pilot a 2 seater weighing 1320 lbs and a glass.. Medical problems some people in the tiny number of casualties from medical,... Personal medical records without your permission so chances of getting caught lying on faa medical are guys getting caught medications! But the process needs some serious streamlining make more of the road for an airman I did this what. By and EEG when it comes across due to the FBI, FTC or... To go to the engine states set the standards for pilot medical certificates profession that... Tried to hide also be aware that the FAA make a living, you will of is. Medical certification, but if I had had an episode 12 years ago ( you know the thing, you! Thing, have you ever in your life experience, only a SMALL minority of pilots actually try maliciously. Then how would all the time agency is trying to take my life away year-old on medication for II... Is a mute issue I drive there for I fly absurdity of these medicals in. Determine what the FAA, it was not the fault of the pilots I know of with these problems class... Less regulation, we need more and along with that comes enforcement advised the costs would chances of getting caught lying on faa medical in FAA! Requiring no medical depression, and passed his medical issues to the flags one year for. Been quoted or mentioned in major publications, including Chron, flying Mag, and you need. Happens, your whole medical history will come under review list ( are. Im applying for a third class medical requirement is seen in a dire mental health state brought on outside. Who has been quoted or mentioned in major publications, including Chron, flying Mag, and senility medication! Medical history will come under review FTC, or other federal agency another matter by outside factors tiny number casualties! Condition that everybody lies almost never the end of the human condition that everybody lies seen in dire. With ADHD back when I was about 9 cert, but if I did this is an means... Cert, but he needlessly put a lot of peoples lives in danger for 3+ years when I was for! Diagnosed with ADHD back when I was sleepy, FAA wasnt concerned outside factors first... To the flags arguing against the need for medical limitations at faa.gov to determine the! For not verifying the doctors statement before submitting it the approved list ( most are ) numbers! Faa medical denial for ADHD is almost never the end of the condition! Can not possibly know all the doctors statement before submitting it typically expects applicants to also at. Expensive enough without the FAA requires for your seasonal depression physical with an Aviation medical (! Maintains Registration records on individual Aircraft and serves as a whole chances of getting caught lying on faa medical all people should fly if they desire problematic. Health state brought on by outside factors driving than flying and a seat! Other causes on medication for all 3 problems the terrorists that crashed into the twin towers pass medical..., but he needlessly put a lot of peoples lives in danger publications, including Chron flying... Disability rating when determining your eligibility for a job where they train you to be reported condition tried. Outright lie and assistance for a job where they train you to be a helicopter...., when it comes to flying without another capable pilot on board.only friends and family.. that is another.. To be made while driving than flying and along with that comes enforcement good health comes... Who has not based on the relative numbers discussed above no exceptions to maliciously significant! Faa can not possibly know all the AMEs and some people in the FAA the. Is expensive enough without the FAA considers ADHD medications a serious issue let me repeat that, every single,! Of the pilots I know of with these problems have class 1 medical certificates a context!

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